Show Me, Show You

[thefourthvine]

Last night, I was talking to frostfire_17, and she described someone as "classically gorgeous."

I pointed out that I had no idea what that meant. I wasn't kidding. I really don't. Best Beloved has given up on me on this score; she has instituted a series of rules to keep me from getting attacked by a mob because I accidentally describe a celebrity as, for example, "oddly stretched" when that person is, in fact, the apex of beautiful perfection. (Sample rule: If I think a man looks like any member of the rodent family, he is in fact exceedingly attractive, and I should not share my opinion with others until I am sure they don't have pitchforks.) But I have always had the belief that if I simply looked at enough pictures, I wouldn't have this problem. (I have no problem, for the record, knowing what I mean by gorgeous. But I want to know what other people mean, too.)

Since I had a willing victim right there, last night I asked Frost to name some classically gorgeous people. It went sort of like this (names redacted for reasons that will become clear):

Frostfire: There's always [name of person].
Me, studying the results of a google search: He looks like a man who really wants to sell you expensive real estate, even though he was up all night doing lines off Aaron Sorkin's ass.
Frost: But when he was younger - okay. Never mind. How about [name of other person]?
Me: Seriously? Look at his Wikipedia photo!
Frost: Oh my GOD. Don't use the Wikipedia photos. Go to Google Image search like a normal person.
Me, managing to whine in text: But then there's too many pictures.
Frost, patiently: But I am going to tell you which pictures to look at. Okay, got it? First one, last one on the first row.
Me: ...How can those possibly be the same person?

At that point, I decided to call the experiment on the grounds of keeping Frost from hating me. But I still want to know what other people mean by gorgeous. I've just learned that what I need is for people with functioning Gorgeousness Determination Circuits to let me borrow their brains.

So, this is where you come in! If you have a functioning GDC and some time on your hands, that is. What I want - what I very very much want oh please oh please - is for you to pick out a specific photo of a famous person, one that you think embodies the term "classically gorgeous." (I am avoiding all other kinds of hotness for the moment, on the grounds that I am very easily confused, especially when looking at pictures.) Then post it here, so I do not get distracted by the plethora of images of that person on the internet. (One thing I learned last night: the more famous you are, the more truly awful photos of you there are in the world.)

And please remember to include the name of the person, because it's not like I will ever have a clue otherwise. (This is why I give up on "Post hot pictures!" threads. For one thing, I am never sure what kind of hot the posters mean. For another thing, I never have any idea who the people are, which makes it - confusing. Am I looking at the same person over and over? Or are these all different people? What is going on? Why do the pixels mock me? And then I have to close the tab or start ranting on street corners.)

Comments

[petra]

Christina Hendricks, and on the male side, Paul Gross.

I agree with other posters who note that "classically beautiful" is a very Western European-specific ideal. It's only incidentally congruent with "People I find extremely attractive."

[eleanorjane]

+1 very much to Paul Gross; he was going to be my male example.

[malnpudl]

Another +1 for Paul Gross, though I was going to offer this image.

[brownbetty]

Yes, that straight nose on Christina Hendricks in particular pings my sense of what is “classical.”

[starwatcher]

.
I commented later (p 2) that I have similar difficulties recognizing 'gorgeous' as other people do. Now, looking at the linked pictures, I'm realizing that studied, 'posed' views do nothing for me; most of them look like plastic mannequins. I seem to need someone looking lifelike, preferably with a smile, caught in mid-action.

But when I saw the Paul Gross link, I thought "Cool!" and clicked; I loved him in Due South. I'm assuming that the particular picture you linked is one you consider demonstrates the aspects you mean -- your definition of 'gorgeous'. I looked at it and went, "Oh, god!" -- and it was an exclamation of dismay. I would not have recognized him and, to me, that person looks... I dunno, I don't have a word for it. But it's not a person I would gravitate toward.

All this to say, maybe those of us who don't recognize 'gorgeous' will not be able to, regardless of examples, just as my dad can't recognize the difference between pink and peach, no matter how often I show/explain it.

But it's an interesting exercise, and I salute your participation in educating others.
.

[petra]

With Paul Gross, it's a facial shape thing (leaving aside that the rest of his body is pretty well-kept too). He's pretty when he is all Mountied up (due South, because Murder Most Likely was disturbing) , when he's scruffy and directing (Slings & Arrows), when he's playing evil in a sexy way (Eastwick), or when he's hitting on women in a swingers' club (Tales of the City).

Love is not love which alters when it alteration finds Classically proportioned features are classically proportioned features, whatever the person they belong to is doing. I can definitely see having a different response to all of these characters (marry Fraser, fuck Geoffrey Tennant, and cliff both Darryl Van Horne and Brian Hawkins, conveniently in link order) but that's not the same thing to me.

[starwatcher]

.
Classically proportioned features are classically proportioned features, whatever the person they belong to is doing.

I understand what you're saying, but I simply don't see 'classically proportioned'. I read someone's description on p2, and I can follow that guide feature by feature -- eyes set right, nose, face shape, lips... yes, yes, yes, yes -- but when I put it all together, it's gone. I wouldn't even recognize those guys as the same person if you hadn't told me... but then, I once didn't recognize my own brother until he spoke. (I hadn't seen him in two years, and he'd grown a full beard and had a hat pulled low on his forehead, but still!)

For me, unless a person is a very close associate, changing a hairstyle or putting on / taking off glasses is enough to move someone from 'known' to 'who's that... seems familiar'. We all think Lois Lane should have recognized Superman as her buddy Clark, despite combed-back hair and lack of glasses -- I think so, too -- but I know I would have been fooled, too.

OTOH, I can recognize mockingbird, house finch, killdeer, avocet, roadrunner, curlew, and meadowlark within two notes -- and I recognize actors' voices long before I recognize their faces. We're all wired differently.
.

[petra]

Oddly enough, I'm pretty good at recognizing actors, but when my partner of quite a few years shaved his mustache and beard for the first time since I'd met him, I kept having moments of "Who the hell is that--oh. Hi, honey." Apparently he was coded as "that dude with the facial hair" in my head. I didn't get used to his clean-shaven appearance before he decided to grow it in again.

[starwatcher]

.
Wow! That must have been disconcerting.
.

Slightly OT

[voske]

Apparently, there is such a thing as 'dyslexia for faces', prosopagnosia.

Re: Slightly OT

[starwatcher]

.
I've heard of it, but doubt I have it -- or, if I do, it's a very mild form. I suspect my problem stems from 50 years of extreme near-sightedness combined with not wearing my glasses very often. Except for the chalk-board in the classroom (when young) or driving (when adult), I preferred to walk around in a blurry world to wearing my glasses. I simply have insufficient practice with visual identification. <g>

When I see someone (RL or actor), I know I've seen them before but 'can't put my finger on it'. I'm a speech therapist, and need to learn 60 new students each year. When I have a group, I use memory tricks to get the names right -- Tomas is taller than George, and Susan has shorter hair than Petra. (I deliberately choose a description that starts with the same letter as the name.) But when I meet one of them in the hall, my mind spins its wheels -- Eek! Which one out of 45 is this? (The other 15 are in a different school.)

I'm getting better -- I consider it rude to not know someone's name when I see them consistently, and I'm really trying -- but it's a struggle, and I doubt it will ever come easily.

When it comes to actors, it's their job to look different / be a different character. Without place or conversational clues, I can easily watch 30 minutes of a movie before I go, "Wait... I know that person! It's... it's... oh, he/she was in..."

Fortunately, in many aspects of life, facial-recognition skills aren't vital. I just hope I never have to pick someone out of a police lineup.
.

[peoriapeoriawhereart]

His hair in your photo I think was used in sculptures.