thefourthvine | Poll: Hot or Not?

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Poll: Hot or Not?

Recently, I was discussing the writing of porn with a party who shall remain nameless (unless she chooses to be named). The key part of the conversation went kind of like this:

Her: I'm writing porn that is very difficult.
Me: *sympathy*
Me: *rambling about ME ME ME*
Me, continuing to ramble: Like, when I was writing my Yuletide 2005 story, my recipient requested "hot het porn." And what I wrote was unbelievably not hot, the antithesis of hot. You were there for the shrieking hysterical breakdown, so I don't need to recapitulate.
[Note: For those many lucky folks not there for the breakdown: there was shrieking. And hysterics. And a post that is, mercifully, locked privately away forever, but can be summarized as, "I will fail my recipient and ruin Yuletide. I LOSE." In conclusion: porn does not come easily to some of us, and if you're just snickering at that, well, okay. I am, too. Join me in my club for the incurably low-minded!]
Me, still rambling: And when I reread that story, it is still the antithesis of hot, at least to me.
Me, rambling ever on: In fact, I don't think I've ever found anything I've written even remotely hot. Huh. Perhaps this is why I am so very bad at writing porn.
Her: ...I find the porn I write hot.
Me: Ooo. I feel a poll coming on.

And then I realized that today I would be in need of distraction. So - here is that poll. And it's only for people who have ever written any kind of porn, of any stripe, except the last question, which can be taken by anyone.

For the purposes of this poll, "porn" doesn't have to be NC-17 or even R; it just has to be erotic in intent. And you don't have to have written a lot of it. Once is enough! And it doesn't have to have been fan fiction, either. And any manner of porn - boy parts, girl parts, a delightful mixture of parts, merman/centaur (no, do not ask where the merman keeps his parts, for that way lies madness), tentacles galore, whatever - is equally valid.

Pimping of this poll would be not only welcome but, given the topic, entirely appropriate. If you know porn writers, why not ask them to come on over? I'd appreciate it. Distract me, people! I'm begging. Nicely.

[Poll #948511]

Threaded | Top-Level Comments Only

I put "it depends" because it depends on the story -- some of them, I still find very hot, and found it hot while I was writing it, and some I cringe at. I will say that the things I find hot are the same things/stories that OTHER people find hot, which are also the same as the stories that I found EASY to write.

Maybe the struggling is visible? I don't know.

(Oh, and I owe you a comment from the amazing, interesting thing you wrote at my other LJ. I suck at updating over there.)

I like my porn, but then I generally write stuff that suits my own kinks (such as rimming or Fraser in boots (♥)).

I don't have a hard time writing porn, but I rarely found what I'm reading to be hot. Uhm, except for once in awhile. Like Sway. And I thhink it has to do with why I'm writing it. Like, if I'm writing it because I feel a scene or story needs sex (or even just wants it) I'm, like, "Okay. Okay! Jesus. Here!. But if I'm writing it for someone else?

Uhm. Hotter. While, I'm writing it's hotter.

Hmm.

I think that probably says more about me than I wanted to know.

I suck at writing porn, it is hard hard hard. I can only really write it at 5 AM when I'm supposed to be asleep; this is the only time chars ever turn up in my mind in an erotic mood. Any other time I'm just forcing it and often find myself actually unable to think up, not only the properly descriptive vocabulary, but simply the actions I want to describe ("Okay, he gives him a blow job! And then...um. He...puts his mouth...umm...where's that dartboard? Ah, hell with this." *fade to black*) I am also convinced that anyone who professes to find my porn hot is just being nice to me. Though sometimes reading a fic much after the writing of it, I'll find myself being a little turned on.

Of course I often suck at reading porn, in that if it's not very well written and/or very character appropriate and/or plot-relevant and/or I have been waiting 100 pages I damn well BETTER read this consummation - I will just skim it to get back to the story proper. I am the worst slash fan ever.

oh, this is so interesting and I can't wait to see what other people vote and say.

For me, every answer was a 'sometimes' because, I dont know. if it's something that I really *want* to be writing, or something thats a total kink of *mine* that I'm putting in there, then yes, I will totally think it's hot while I'm writing it, and even afterward when rereading it sometimes.

but a lot of times, and this ties into the 'do you find writing porn easy' question, a lot of times my story itself is the story, the banter, the arguing, etc, that *leads* to the porn, so to me writing the porn is just dragging things on and it gets boring (to write) and I feel like, well I did what I set out to do, ie: get them together, but I KNOW that the real ending people want (and what *I* want in other peoples fic) is a nice, porny resolution, so I do it for that reason, and those times it's far less hot (to me) to read and write. so I'll be surprised when I get comments like, ZOMG SO HOT!! on something that to me was a pain in the ass to produce.

if that makes sense.

also, I think it has a lot to do with how long you've been in your fandom, etc. in the beginning I couldnt *wait* to get whoever - jared and jensen - in bed. now, after literally eighty-something stories with jensen as a main character, I'm tired of trying to think of new ways to make him come.

*koff*

While I'm writing, there's usually too much logistical stuff going on for me to find it sexy. "Didn't he just touch his nuts? I think he did. GODDAMMIT, that was an IMPORTANT PLOT POINT," &c. Reading the story over later, it's usually okay enough that I'll shift in my seat, a little, like "goodness, did I write that? Haha, nut-touching." The stuff that I've allowed people to read has usually gotten a higher "hotness rating" (for lack of a better word) than I would have given it myself.

I'm a bit boggled that anyone would spend time writing porn that isnt' hot to them, unless they were writing it as a gift for someone else. All my sex scenes, back when I was writing them, came straight from my own desires, filtered through the characters I loved. How could that not be hot? And it's still hot to me, years after I stopped writing the stuff or even following those particular fandoms.

I often wrote stories because nobody else was writing what I wanted to read. I made my own fun. (: If I miss anything about writing fic, it's that, because there's still nobody writing what I want to read...but now I'm not doing anything to fill that gap.

This all sounds very solipsistic, and as if I never got off on anybody else's fic, which is so not the case. But it was a rare thing when somebody else's fic could make me as hot as my own.

Back in the olden days, when I actually was able to *write* porn, the only time I found it hot was when I was *first* writing it. Later in the process, while editing, I generally began to find it boring, although still readable. Later, after posting, if I was brave enough to go back and read it, I usually found it boring and simultaneously laughable and/or cringe-inducing. (Hmmm...I think that applies to a lot of things I write, though, whether they're porny or not.)

Now I just find porn to be almost impossible to write in the first place. *loses*

I can't actually *write* the stuff unless I'm finding it hot. Otherwise I just get tangled up in logistics and bored and fed up and think it all sounds stupid, and I go off to write some other scene. I usually save the sex scenes for the time of the month when, uh, my hormones are at their peak.

Hey, I sort of inspired a poll!

Similarly after smelling and sampling my own chili for 15 minutes--much less half a day--I find it neither hot nor appealing and have zero interest to partake in it. It is offered up in a sense of obligation. That is simply what is expected by of one by that point.

*g*

You're going to get a lot of "It depends" answers on this one, I'm betting.

When I'm working on porn, it's pretty much always hot to me at the concept stage, when I'm deciding what's going to happen.

While I'm actually writing it, it's an interesting puzzle, not hot at all.

Once it's written, it usually goes dead on me. (That last sex scene in Adorned (http://trickster.org/res/adorned.html) is the only exception; oddly, it stayed hot to me for some time after it was written, though by now custom has staled its infinite variety.)

Otherwise I just get tangled up in logistics and bored and fed up and think it all sounds stupid, and I go off to write some other scene.

HA. You've just described exactly what writing sex scenes are for me, almost every single time.

Maybe the struggling is visible? I don't know.

Innnnnteresting. Because I have found, for me, that the struggling (and hysterics, and weeping on the shoulders of my betas, and just generally being emo!pornographer) is not, I don't think, visible to my readers. Like, okay, the Yuletide story I wrote for you? Probably was the easiest for me of any porn I've actually written (um...all three pieces), just because, well, Perry is toppy. And what I learned is that, unsurprisingly, I can do toppy, because I am quite a toppy bitch myself. And even so, it was Aeryn Sun type writing, whereas the rest of it just kind of babbled out onto the page (probably because Harry is the Man Who Won't Shut Up, and I feel a strong bond of sympathy, there) - so easy and fun! I just don't think that the difference in ease of writing between the porny bits and the Harry autobabble is obvious to the reader. ...I hope not, anyway.

Oh, and I owe you a comment from the amazing, interesting thing you wrote at my other LJ. I suck at updating over there.

In your own time! Or not at all! Seriously, I don't leave comments - especially incredibly tl;dr comments - to force other people to reply to them. It's always reply at will. (Unless I'm asking, you know, a direct question like, "ARE YOU DEAD OR WHAT?" In which case I am very definitely hoping for a reply.)

See, even when I'm writing my own kinks, and generally I end up doing that to some degree, I still don't find it hot. It's just this total disconnect for me, where all I can see is god, I remember that horrible sentence and did I really write that? and so on.

But this is why I have Porn Dysfunction. I am convinced of it.

I don't have a hard time writing porn, but I rarely found what I'm reading to be hot.

I hate you. How can you write porn that well and have it not be hard? Or is it because you write it that well that it's not hard? Or is it that good because it's not hard?

...I think I just got lost in my own paragraph. In conclusion: I am green with envy, but then, that is nothing new.

And I thhink it has to do with why I'm writing it.

Very interesting. And not actually all that surprising to me, since you write stories for other people differently than you do your big, plotty STORIES - there you're almost recording what you already see, and you always type ahead of yourself, and porn takes time, so I'm not surprised you're like, "FINE. You can fuck, because now is when you fuck, but then we are getting back to the plot, misters. There's cars to be stolen! Demons to be hunted! Heads to be lopped off! I have things to do with you!"

I think that probably says more about me than I wanted to know.

Hah. My LJ is a tool for unwelcome self-realization! (And - you realize that the next time we share a fandom I will totally use that as an excuse to demand LOTS of porn from you, right? Gift porn for every occasion, including Arbor Day. I am not kidding.)

I also feel like a very untypical writer because I like a lot of the stuff I write even as I am writing it. I do have my moments of "WTF am I writing here?" and "OMG I should never be permitted to write again", but on a whole I like my stuff and think it's not terribly bad (it might be a little bad), so in general I have a very positive opinion of my stories. It make me feel quite arrogant at times because sometimes I feel like there's a paradigm of writing out there which is: "do not EVER like something you've written, unless 1000 people have told you it's good".

But I also end up writing my porn at night (like one hour before the deadline), so sleep-deprivation is ~~my friend~~ preventing me from having any coherent thoughts anyway. ;)

Okay, so, in the rare occasions I have written porn, it went like this:

Me: Wow, I just had a pornlet so hot that my panties spontaneously combusted hit me like a brick to the head! Perhaps I should write it down!
Me (writing): …but, where has all the hot gone?!?
Me (reading): …okay, kinda, but it's not as hot as it was in my head.

I think the problem is that writing porn is a balancing act in that one has to be able to reach for the porn-brain to check the temperature, as it were, but write with the non-porn brain. Writing with my porn brain would probably be a stupid mash of verbs and adjectives connected by ellipses.

I suck at writing porn, it is hard hard hard.

*bonds*

*fade to black*

*snickers*

Um, yeah. I'm quite the fan of the fade to black myself. (Also the no-payoff porn, which makes my betas scream at me.)

Of course I often suck at reading porn, in that if it's not very well written and/or very character appropriate and/or plot-relevant and/or I have been waiting 100 pages I damn well BETTER read this consummation - I will just skim it to get back to the story proper. I am the worst slash fan ever.

If you are, then let's share table at the Worst Slash Fans Ever con. I will skim sex scenes unless they're, you know, in character and right. Sometimes I find myself wishing a story that is not only porny but in my pairing was gen, because the plot is amazing, can we get back to the plot?

But I tend to think that my disengagement is - well, if I was sold on the porn, if it served an important character or plot purpose, if it was part of the conflict or tension or whatever, then I know I'd read the porn with joy. So I tend not blame my disengagement on me. Disavowing personal responsibility for the win!

I find writing porn to be nearly impossible and rarely even try. Sex scenes tend to play like a movie in my head, which is quite hot, but on paper they come out in what amounts to blocking, which is not, and never will be. I am not sure if this is due to my own hang-ups or because most of my formal writing training is in playwrighting, so I'm not good at description in general beyond the basics of action and scenery.

Case in point, I'm playing with a Supernatural/Friday Night Lights crossover right now (Dean/Sam/Tyra Collette) and 2300 words of build-up flowed like water in about four hours. Then Dean and Tyra started getting it on and it screeched to a dead stop for a week until I gave up and faded to black. Hopefully I'll be able to go back and add the sex in later, because it actually does have a point in the plot, but I'm not overly counting on it.

Can't really help that I don't read a whole lot of porn either, though. I apparently have the mind of a 12 year old. Unless, as

xparrot said above, it is "very well written and/or very character appropriate and/or plot-relevant and/or I have been waiting 100 pages I damn well BETTER read this consummation" I start snickering over words like "cock" and "cunt" and end up ruining the mood and, often as not, just skipping over the sex entirely to get back to the plot.

if that makes sense.

It makes total sense. I take it you don't actually write 14k words of porn on your lunch hour, then? Because I totally believed Slod when she said that.

also, I think it has a lot to do with how long you've been in your fandom, etc.

Oh, I can totally see that. Because for me, how much interest I have in reading porn is a function of how long I've been in fandom in general, and also in any given fandom specifically - like, I still love it to bits, but in the beginning, it was like a buffet when you're starving: oh my god it all looks good! And now it's more like a buffet when you just kind of want to snack: you pick and choose and eat only the very tastiest things. And the gooey desserts, of course. ...Um. That metaphor may have kind of gone unfortunate on me, but you know what I mean, right?

I'm tired of trying to think of new ways to make him come.

He's so demanding. But, hey, he has needs! And you meet them! That makes you a Good Citizen. *awards you Fannish Good Citizen prize, with suitable trophy image on top, meaning you can never ever display it in your home or office*

While I'm writing, there's usually too much logistical stuff going on for me to find it sexy.

Oh, god, the logistical stuff. That's a nightmare for me - suddenly I have to worry about, like, did I have him a shoulder holster? How the hell will he get his shirt off over that, what with all the tentacles? And, and, god, did I just have them have penetrative sex without ever taking her pants off? (Both things I have done, for the record. Betas saved me. Betas are goddesses who walk the earth.) I am so bad at keeping track of everyone's clothes and hands and just - stuff.

Disorganized people shouldn't write porn, maybe?

The stuff that I've allowed people to read has usually gotten a higher "hotness rating" (for lack of a better word) than I would have given it myself.

Perhaps this is a sign you should allow people to read more of your stuff. *hints in a totally unsubtle fashion*

I'm a bit boggled that anyone would spend time writing porn that isnt' hot to them, unless they were writing it as a gift for someone else.

And there you have it: almost all of my porn has been written as a gift or as commentfic for someone else. ...Actually, I don't think I've ever written porn except as a gift.

I give strange gifts, apparently.

But my natural level of writing, if I'm writing to entertain myself, is gen or vague intimations of sexuality. I'm not a natural porn writer. It's a chicken or egg problem, I guess: am I not a natural porn writer because I can't find my own writing hot? Or do I not find my own writing hot because I'm not a natural porn writer?

*contemplates in manner of koan*

*does not achieve enlightenment*

I echo the other people who said the porny idea, before writing it down, was hot, and then the act of writing it down and making it essentially a mental exercise just de-hotted it. Very sad.

Only very rarely have I felt turned on in the process of writing, or felt turned on by my own porn when I went back to re-read it (and that was after a rather long time and a lot of distance -- in immediate re-reads I only ever see the flaws and problems). But even with those instances, I was nowhere near as turned on as I can get reading other people's stories, or imagining the scenario in my own head before I mess it all up with words.

For me, porn sometimes just happens. I've written maybe one story that was a straight up PWP for the sake of it. And that one took no effort; it, in fact, pretty much wrote itself as fast as I could type it and I still think it's probably the hottest thing I've ever done. Basically, if you have to try and plan and think it out and make an effort, porn isn't good. It's better when it's spontaneous and exciting and easy. Much like sex.

Okay. I've had times when I've had to stop writing because the porn was turning me on so much I was losing focus. And I've also had times when writing the porn was practically impossible. I tend to get writer's block more with porn than with non-porn. I just sometimes hit a wall and I can't get my characters into bed (or against a wall, or over a table, or whatever) to save my life. They just want to snark at each other or hang out or they realize they don't really like each other after all or they turn into drunks or...

So the easy/hard thing just varies for me. And sometimes I find my porn hot and other times I think it's crap and am surprised when my betas think it works. What can I say, I'm fickle.

As to how I react vs. how my readers react? I often worry that what I think is the hottest part of the porn is not going to appeal to my readers and I'm always surprised when some comments that something is hot. I fret a lot about if something's going to work or not, esp. if it's a weird pairing or a more unconventional situation (like Stella fisting RayK -- which was really well received and I thought was very hot, but expected people to NOT like). And also because I worry like this, I think I tend to sometimes write more for my audience and less to my own tastes, so in those situations I don't always find my stuff to be as hot as my readers.

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Poll: Hot or Not?

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