[Poll]: Where do we go from here?

[thefourthvine]

Okay, I've put this off long enough. (Hi, my name is TFV, and I'm totally change-phobic. I hold the regional title for hiding-head-in-sand, and am a certified expert in change denial. Need mentoring in the fine art of fearing change? I am here for you.)

Seems to me that, what with the ever-changing and quite confusing ToS on LJ, it's only reasonable for me to do something besides post all my content to LJ and just kind of hope I don't lose it. (Yes, I have backups, but not, at this time, a real offsite backup.) But, of course, I'm waffling on what I'm going to do. When in doubt, poll!

Also, every day I'm seeing deletions and departure notices, and I kind of want to figure out where everyone is going before you're all, you know, gone. I realize I'm too late to catch the first wave of LJ departures, so if any of you cross-post or do newsletter things or also journal on another service, I'd really appreciate a link. (This isn't just for people on my friends list, by the way. There are journals I read that I don't have friended, after all.) So, again, a poll seems like a good way to collect information.

I know people who don't have LJ accounts anymore - as in, deleted or suspended - can't actually take the poll. In that case, feel free to answer whichever questions you choose (including, ideally, the location of your journal-type content and your fanworks) in the comments. Anonymous commenting is on. If you can't do that, either, then feel free to email me. I want to know where you are!

It's probably getting really boring seeing polls like this all over your friends list. I'm sorry. But I don't want to lose my content or my community, so - well, I'd really appreciate it if you'd take mine. (If it makes you grouchy, there's an option in the poll to tell me to just quit LJing. Feel free to use it!)



[Poll #1050367]

Comments

[qem_chibati]

http://qem-chibati.insanejournal.com/5575.html
I pooled together a list of resources for IJ a while ago, but the ones you'd want I think are:

http://www.greatestjournal.com/users/snapetoy/16797.html
- Semagic for magic cross posting powers!

http://brown-betty.livejournal.com/284083.html
- Exporting lj entries to another journal or saving them on your computer.

LJ-archive saves comments etc into something *you* can read on your computer, lj-sec takes your posts (but not comments) and posts them to another journal of your choice.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Awesome. I had the brown_betty's already, and I have LJ-archive and LJ-sec, but that second link was just what I was looking for. Thank you!

Off to explore the rest of your resources now.

[qem_chibati]

Also; RSS readers I use depend on how frequently the site updates and my interest level.

I either use live bookmarks on firefox (where I expect high chaff ratios and don't care if I miss a link) or google reader http://www.google.com/reader/view/ - like a flist just for you!

I haven't yet gotten any rss reader to work on syndicated friendlocked entries although there are some people who say it is possible if you add your username and password to the syndicated link - you can see entries that you would have access to if logged in on lj.

I've heard good things about a couple of programs but nothing that I wanted to use extensively just yet.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

There's one program that I'm looking into. Which, damn it, I don't have the link. But, yeah, I'd love something reliable that allowed me to view secured posts and aggregates everything in one place, and I don't know of such a beast just yet. Ah, well. I can yearn, anyway.

[derryderrydown.livejournal.com]

If you want a JF account, I can get one set up for you?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Yes! That'd be way cool. Thank you!

[glammetalkitten.livejournal.com]

Hi, lurker poking her head above the ground here :)

As I'm not always the most technological person on this her interwebs, I had a few issues getting the Semagic cross-posting tool to work. My friend gave me a different set of instructions (http://glammetalkitten.insanejournal.com/384853.html?thread=853#t853) which worked beautifully!

I'm still having trouble keeping track of everyone who has moved, and would love it if some clever person could come up with a way for me to have one flist which pooled all my friends from all the journal services! One can always hope, I guess....

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Hi, lurker!

Thanks for the link; I hypothetically have everything set to crosspost, but, well, the real test will be actually doing it. I may well need those instructions, since things do not always work as they're supposed to.

I'm still having trouble keeping track of everyone who has moved, and would love it if some clever person could come up with a way for me to have one flist which pooled all my friends from all the journal services!

Yup, it's difficult; I don't want to miss anyone, but at the same time, I'm not sure I'm up to three or four friends lists. (In all honesty, it's hard to keep up with one.) I'm seriously hoping that one of the programs people have recommended to aggregate feeds actually works. *crosses fingers*

[odditycollector.livejournal.com]

In the near future, how can a recommendations source (like, you know, me) be of most use to you?

If you don't want to do proper crossposting, you could picking a place (LJ, a proper blog, where ever) where you feel comfortable and set up a feed for those hanging elsewhere.

(I personally am currently doing crossposting to IJ more or less, but duplication mildly offends my sensibilities just the same.)

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

See, yeah. Duplication isn't ideal, but then at least I'd have a backup in case one of the sites went wonky, and also people who have migrated away could read me without feeding me if they wanted. (Feeds are problematic in a number of ways, not least because they seem to eliminate cuts, which - I post a *lot* of text sometimes. I also sometimes discuss spoilers for the stories I'm recommending. So it'd be nice if my cut tags worked, and on feeds, they won't. At least, that was the case the last time I was on a feed. On the other hand, feeds are easy. So...yeah. Have I mentioned I'm not good with change or decision-making?)

[marycrawford.livejournal.com]

In the near future, how can a recommendations source (like, you know, me) be of most use to you?

The answers to this one all feel way too negative or way too imperative ("you must post to LJ AND ONLY TO LJ! Forswear all others!"). I love your recs and it would please me greatly if you kept posting them to LJ, as I'll be staying on LJ for a while, but if you crossposted to various journal sites that would be fine too, and if you were to move to a blog-type thing I would just add your RSS feed to my blog reader.

I'm staying on LJ because I don't really think there is a better alternative - as GJ and IJ expand, they'll probably run into the same problems as LJ is dealing (badly) with right now.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Hi hi hi! I have an email response in draft form to send to you, and I must get it finished and off to you before, oh, next August. Coming soon to an inbox near you! I hope!

I love your recs and it would please me greatly if you kept posting them to LJ, as I'll be staying on LJ for a while, but if you crossposted to various journal sites that would be fine too, and if you were to move to a blog-type thing I would just add your RSS feed to my blog reader.

Thank you! And my guess is that I'll be staying on LJ for a while, no matter what else I do. It's just, with the new linking policy - all I do is link. I don't think it's at all likely that I'll get into trouble, at least in the short term, but if the possibility is there I'd like to have a backup, you know?

I'm staying on LJ because I don't really think there is a better alternative - as GJ and IJ expand, they'll probably run into the same problems as LJ is dealing (badly) with right now.

I certainly expect this. (And, yes, I agree - there's no single better alternative right now; a flat-out move is unlikely to be my choice.) I mean, it took quite a while for trouble to find us on LJ, but anyone who truly wants to make trouble now knows exactly how to, so - yeah, I think IJ and GJ are likely have the same sorts of issues in the future. But I do think crossposting at least gives me a bit of redundancy, which is a kind of security. (Kind of annoying, too, for people who are following more than one list, but I assume they'll cut me in every place but one.)

[svmadelyn.livejournal.com]

I'm of the personal opinion that if people want to read your blog, they're going to find a way to read your blog - off a feed, whatever - and that we all barely have enough time as it is, and I'd rather people spend their time creating actual content than making it breezily easy for someone to read their blog. I think it should be...earned! Yes. (More that, if they want to read you through a feed, it's totally easy to do so and it saves the annoyance of cross-posting.)

*wiggles fingers* If you do decide you wish to go the webhosting route, you're welcome to a subdomain on my site, if you'd like it. It comes with a one-click wordpress install that I could do for you - Pru, Eleveninches and I all have ones set up with much success and whatnot. Um, anyway. I give people a free year, and then after that it's divided up by however many people are on the site at the time, so never more than like, 20.00 a year for virtually unlimited space/bandwidth. It's good times. :D

Anyway, the option's there for you if you ever want it! *g*

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Ooo, thank you! I have no idea if website with Wordpress is the direction I'm going, but I tell you, I am very very tempted. A home on the web! That would be very cool.

(More that, if they want to read you through a feed, it's totally easy to do so and it saves the annoyance of cross-posting.)

I figure cross-posting is going to be more of an annoyance for other people and a convenience for me; if I stay entirely on journal sites, it's the only way to have a decent offsite backup. (Okay, I mean, I have my hard drive in an offsite backup, but while LJarchive saves my posts, it doesn't allow me to do much with them, and LJSec is only of limited use. If I'm sticking to journals, an actual backup journal would be much handier. ...And, nice. Now I've typed "journal" so much it doesn't look like a real word. I win at repetition!)

[china_shop]

By continuing to post recs to LiveJournal and only to LiveJournal.

I said that, but I agree with marycrawford about it sounding negative. I just meant, that's where I'm most likely to read you. But I'd strike out the "and only to LiveJournal" if the poll gave me that option. :-)

[rydra_wong]

Thirded. I really don't care whether something's only posted to LJ, or whether it's posted in other places as well :).

[flambeau.livejournal.com]

I don't like change, either. Troublesome stuff. I've noticed that my flist seems quiet lately, but I thought it was just the season...

Anyway. I'm torch on journalfen, but that's about it, and I don't post there. Or read there, come to think of it.

The more I try to think about this stuff, the more I think about other things I could do instead, like write, or bake bread, or clean the oven. heh.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I've noticed that my flist seems quiet lately, but I thought it was just the season.

It could just be the season, depending on what fandoms your friends list is currently in. Some fandoms haven't changed at all, but one of the fandoms I follow closely is leaving almost en masse.

The more I try to think about this stuff, the more I think about other things I could do instead, like write, or bake bread, or clean the oven.

This was my approach, yes. (My bread recipes! Let me show you them. Although my oven remains regrettably unclean.) But, actually, looking at the poll, things don't look too bad. We'll apparently have more people posting their fanworks off LJ, which is quite frankly a very good thing - one of the big problems with LJ is that it really doesn't work as an archive - and personal-type content will mostly stay here, with some people who will need to be put on a feed or aggregated or whatever. So I think I feel slightly better for having made this post. (Which, for me, is a huge win, because even thinking about this brings on a major fit of change-phobic wibbles.)

[ratcreature]

I crosspost my personal journal right now to LJ, IJ and GJ, but I recently created an art comm (not exclusively fannish, it's supposed to become a place to practice drawing with others), and I did that on IJ, because of LJ's policy changes that impact art the most. So some of my sketches will probably only be posted there.

I'll keep crossposting for now, and most of my own journal is fairly harmless, but I do have a drawing of Superboy and Robin groping each other for example (not with visible genitals or anything so it's unlikely to cause trouble, but who knows), and one of Batman kissing Robin, and I think I've recced underage stuff which I then linked to, so I don't feel safe on LJ anymore. I mean, I do get semi-frequent trolls because of some comic related posts, and some of these were dedicated enough to create LJs to rail at me in my comments (since I don't allow anonymous ones to prevent spam), and some where really enraged, so I can imagine some of the angrier ones going through my conveniently tagged back entries looking to report things to LJ Abuse with that handy new button, you know?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

LJ's policy changes that impact art the most

At this point, yeah, they do, and that worries me, both because it means artists are being driven out of fandom as a whole and because in some ways art is our canary in the coal mine.

I mean, I do get semi-frequent trolls because of some comic related posts, and some of these were dedicated enough to create LJs to rail at me in my comments (since I don't allow anonymous ones to prevent spam), and some where really enraged, so I can imagine some of the angrier ones going through my conveniently tagged back entries looking to report things to LJ Abuse with that handy new button, you know?

*cringe*

Uh, yeah. Comics discussion does seem to attract a certain element with issues, is about the kindest way I can think of to put it. (Lunatics with an axe to grind would be another way.)

And I am so not looking forward to that Report Abuse button going in, although I a) think I get why they're doing it (legal CYA, I would assume) and b) suspect it's going to be more of a problem for their volunteers than anything else. I mean, yes, it is going to get used in grudges and jokes and all kinds of stupid crap, and that will mean wasting a lot of time. That people are giving LJ for free.

But it will also mean the occasional spot of trouble, and I can easily see any of the comics fans as being targets for that trouble. Which is exactly the problem with the whole differential enforcement thing, but I think other people have covered that far more articulately than I can.

[gloss]

Change is scary! It's also been wonderfully liberating, however, as I moved to IJ. Just saying.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Really? Interesting. I'm honestly so change-phobic I can't really even imagine it going that way for me (I'm always trapped deeped in OMG NO CHANGE NO NO NO mode), but: I'm glad it's working well for you. Yay!

[laylee.livejournal.com]

I'm staying put, mostly because I can't be bothered moving, but also because I can't see it being any better anywhere else. JF, IJ and GJ will likely all come up against similar problems as they grow and who's to say they'll handle it any better than LJ?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I don't think anywhere else is necessarily going to be better, but I do think multiple journals will mean an overall better chance of not, you know, randomly losing all my journal content. And cross-posting looks like it will be easy. (Um. Yeah. Wish me luck, okay?)

[maygra.livejournal.com]

I've got two years of paid time left on this journal, so, it's not going away, but I'm pretty much cross posting now, and the only problem thus far is that Greatest Journal doesn't send notifications when someone comments, ergo, that one's not getting a lot of my attention. I check it about once a day. A lot can happen in two years so, we'll see. I may have hied mysefl to a nunnery before this all falls out.

Anyway, fic, as always is on my journal, and I'm still reading LJ, but I've filtered it down to a much shorter *read every day list*.

[the-shoshanna.livejournal.com]

Greatest Journal doesn't send notifications when someone comments

I certainly get comment notifications, and perfectly timely ones, too. Are you sure your settings at GJ are correct?

Cari-be-gone for all your caribou removal needs!

[dzurlady.livejournal.com]

I'm staying here, because I still like lj better than the alternatives, although if something good comes up I would probably shift to cross posting or set up a feed or something.
I think you should rec however you feel like it, although I like having you here on lj.

But why would anyone want to remove a caribou?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I like being on LJ; I have a permanent account, for one thing, so I don't plan on leaving entirely until fandom leaves me behind. But I do want the backup of another journal. Or a website. *dithers*

[vass]

My thing with InsaneJournal: the insanity theme. Not cute, not funny, not clever. It's not like I've never made, or laughed at, jokes about mental illness, goodness knows. *points to icon*

But IJ goes beyond just the name, and beyond "joke I would laugh at", and into "oh boy, I'm not going there." I've seen the arguments about using it in a reclaiming sense, and the appropriateness of the term 'asylum', and I'd give them more heed if, one, it was mentally ill people who made the joke in the first place, or two, Squeaky'd reacted differently to criticism.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I remember Miriam's exchange with Squeaky, yup, and also of course your posts on this topic, so I wasn't expecting to see you on IJ. (Nor do I think I'll be leaving LJ, so I won't be leaving you behind. Yay!)

And I'm assuming you don't want my two cents on the topic of IJ's theme, though if you do, I'm always here, with pennies in hand. (Or in head. Whatever. The metaphor doesn't extend very well.)

Squidge

[shusu.livejournal.com]

I think a lot of people would be interested in squidgestatus, where Squidge is starting to develop a fandom bloghub. Ideally, *one* flist no matter what blog or journal a fan is using.

Re: Squidge

[musesfool.livejournal.com]

Sadly, that may not be an option for some of us - squidge, along with many other fannish sites, is blocked at my workplace, as is googlereader. Sigh.

[syredronning.livejournal.com]

I'm lazy at the moment and don't feel like crossposting to x journals, but I secured my alternative journals everywhere and will see how lj develops...

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Oh, yes. That's pretty much been me for, well, several months. I really am going to try to get the crossposting going.

...And maybe a website.

Although with my change resistance, you may well yet accomplish all this before me.

[bluemeridian]

It's still easiest for me to aggregate sources through my LJ flist, so even if you would wander off, I'd probably snatch an RSS feed and still view it on LJ.

The tops in RSS readers that I've found is FeedDemon, it's not free but it handles the large amount of feeds I'm running through it (to tag for a newsletter). I've yet to conquer the tricky 'reading of flocked posts' as I don't use an s1 journal style, so if you get any leads on that, I'd be forever grateful for a pointer in that direction!

Semagic is an object of worship. Or should be. Whatever.

Wall-to-wall caribou for the win!!!

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

It's still easiest for me to aggregate sources through my LJ flist, so even if you would wander off, I'd probably snatch an RSS feed and still view it on LJ.

Me, too, which is why I'm not likely to leave LJ, at least not until I figure out the aggregate feeders. I hear rumors of means of managing to get into locked posts via feeds; I will try them out and let you know.

Semagic is an object of worship.

You know, I wasn't all that thrilled with Semagic when I first started using it, but now - now I love it greatly and cannot imagine how I managed to post through the LJ interface all the time.

Wall-to-wall caribou for the win!!!

Evidently so. (I always watch the random chunk of text question with hawk-like interest. It fascinates me what wins and what doesn't.) Have you read the story (http://fearlessdiva.livejournal.com/225139.html) that the quote comes from? (The random chunks of text are things I highlighted and then accidentally clicked copy-to-notes instead of just copy. So they are random samples of my internet wanderings. That one must've come from a comment on the story itself. It's such an awesome line.)

[oddmonster.livejournal.com]

I adore your recs, and in fact, one of them in your latest post has actually impelled me to watch SGA for the first time. So, assuming I am ever seen again, I am hoping your recs continue at least on LJ, because it's getting harder to integrate multiple sources of recs.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

one of them in your latest post has actually impelled me to watch SGA for the first time.

YAY! I have fulfilled my function! *does triumphant dance*

This comment has made me a very happy person. And let me remind you of the many, many awesome SGA stories waiting for you in the back recs. *tempts*

I am hoping your recs continue at least on LJ, because it's getting harder to integrate multiple sources of recs.

I think, wherever I go, they'll continue to be here, at least while there are readers here; I have a permanent account, so I might as well, you know?

[brynwulf]

I was going to offer to set you up a JF account, but I see Derry has done that. Let me know if you need more help over there (like setting up a community). It's in a major growth process right now and everything isn't quite as intuitive as it could be.

Like Maygra, I'm mostly just reading my flist over here, but a very parred down version of what it used to be (And you will ALWAYS be on it!!).

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Let me know if you need more help over there (like setting up a community).

I most assuredly will. Or if I do end up needing - what, is it a code? That you get sent? I don't even know how that works, exactly - I will definitely come whining to you. You are Designated Whine Recipient. There, aren't you sorry now?

(And you will ALWAYS be on it!!)

Yay! *clings*

[rigel-7.livejournal.com]

*clings to LJ*

I'd most probably still read anything you post on my LJ flist - and I'll grab it as an RSS feed should you migrate.

:D

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I don't think a feed will be required, though, as I'll probably keep posting to LJ even if I crosspost or do a website or whatever. But it is flattering to know you'd feed me if you needed to.

[aynatonal.livejournal.com]

I'm staying and I wish everyone else would stay too, although I understand why some people are making the move. I'm Maenad on GJ and I've got you friended, but none of my stuff is posted there and I don't read there (yet).

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I'll still be here, even if I'm also elsewhere; I do understand why some people are making the move entirely, and I sympathize, but I think for me multiple journals is the way to go.

Mostly, I just want all my friends in one place again, but I don't think that's going to happen. WOE.

[watersword]

I'm setting up a personal domain with berne in the next few weeks, and would be more than happy to share the space with you; in the interim, I'm posting as watersword at IJ. Once I get the damn CSS shaken out, ragnell.org will archive our fics (oh, god, I've written that much? I've only been in fandom since 2004, what is wrong with me?), have embedded wordpress blogs, and sooner or later, include an RSS feed of everyone we want to read.

But otherwise, I tend to live mainly in email these days -- it's a more intimate, somehow, and I find myself valuing intimacy.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I am awed. You have, like, a whole *plan*. With details. And stuff.

...I am impressed beyond words. No wonder you get so much done.

And, yeah, email. As wretched a correspondent as I am - and, well, you know how I am - email is definitely my preferred way of getting to know people. On LJ, it's all much more, hmmm. Performance-oriented? No real depth, I don't think.

[j00j.livejournal.com]

I'll happily find your journal wherever it is, because I really enjoy your recs. I say... do whatever makes you comfortable at this point. But then, I'm one of the "wait and see" folks on LJ-- I'm not likely to have a problem unless they go crazy with the link policy (dude, practiaclly all I post is links. Am I going to check every single one to see if it's turned into a pr0n site? No.), but I'm sitting on IJ and JF accounts in case it all goes terribly wrong somehow, heh.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

dude, practiaclly all I post is links. Am I going to check every single one to see if it's turned into a pr0n site? No.

See, yeah, that's me, exactly. Because linking is what I do! It's all I do! Which is why I'm going for either the cross-post or website options. But either way, I will also continue to be here.

Or that's the plan, anyway.

Horatio

[redfiona99.livejournal.com]

>>In the near future, how can a recommendations source (like, you know, me) be of most use to you?<<

Basically, do as you will, but if you're moving to exclusively non-LJ posting, could you leave a forwarding address as it were.

I'm not moving because a lot of the people I have on my f-list post only to LJ so I'd be missing out on them. I use my Deadjournal as a mirror, but I only cross-post non-fanfic posts on there, and I've done that for years.

As for if you change, I can sadly only offer to hold hands because I'm technologically incompetant.

Re: Horatio

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Basically, do as you will, but if you're moving to exclusively non-LJ posting, could you leave a forwarding address as it were.

I don't think I'll be leaving LJ until fandom leaves it; this is more about expanding my options than limiting them. So even if I'm also posting elsewhere, I expect to be here, too.

But if that should change: forwarding address. Totally. I want to be found!

I'm not moving because a lot of the people I have on my f-list post only to LJ so I'd be missing out on them.

The majority of my friends list looks to be staying here, so yeah. At this point, I'll either be reading here or on a feed aggregator, if I can get the security issues worked out.