Poll: Consensus, Part One

[thefourthvine]

So. I miss talking to and hearing from y'all. But I'm suffering from a tiny problem, namely absence of any ability to finish anything. Someday I hope to be able to write actual useful sentences that connect to other sentences again, but today is not that day, so I'm going to do a themed poll series instead of meta or a themed recs post. (There are only three parts to this themed poll set, but I realize that, from me, three posts is totally massive spamming. My apologies in advance.)

The poll's theme is: consensus.

In part one, below, I'm going to try to establish my relative fannish sanity by consensus. To do so, I need to take you on a brief tour of my brain, focusing on two particular fannish things it does that I'm starting to suspect are - well, weird. (And keep in mine I'm judging myself compared to other fans; we'd already be considered insane by many of Them Folks Out There.)

We will now depart on our trip through TFV's brain. Please keep your arms and legs inside the vehicle at all times.

Imaginary Fandoms. I have, um, imaginary fandoms. I don't mean original fiction that I tell myself - I mean original fandoms, where I come up with, for example, a long and detailed original story, and then entertain myself with considering - and sometimes, um, even writing - various types of fan fiction or kerfluffles or meta that might result from given installments of the story. Sometimes I do, like, a TV series, and cast it with imaginary actors and plan out both FPF and RPF. In my most recent imaginary fandom, I've even begun mentally vidding it.

These imaginary fandoms hit basically all my buttons, of course. I'm not actually going to describe this in any kind of detail, because, um, oh my god so embarrassing that I kind of want to die just from typing it out, but the current one involves time traveling teams (one "temporal scientist" and one assassin-ish type) from the future. The main team, at this point (in my head, we have arrived roughly at book or season three), has uncovered evidence that they are working for - and trapped by, and no, I'm not even going to elaborate on the whole legal enslavement aspect, because I do not want to die of embarrassment - an organization of extremely questionable ethics and purpose, which opposes an organization that also has extremely questionable ethics and purpose. Oh, and the timestream, which they're supposed to protect, is slowly dissolving.

I have assorted mental fan fiction for this story, all carefully tagged to various chapters or episodes. I have, as I said, mental vids. I entertained myself on one long, hideous drive to Pasadena imagining the meta resulting from the end of book or season one.

I'm pretty sure that all this is the very definition of sad and pathetic. But, hey, this is fandom - maybe we all do this. Do you?

Epics That Must Not Be Read. (Term borrowed from the only other person I know for sure has written one of these. She will not be named here - unless she just wants to be - out of mercy for her.) Another thing I do is write these long, involved pieces of FF that are only for an audience of one, and that one person is me. They're always AUs of some kind, and they always start in canon and move sharply away from it, and they always entertain the hell out of me. But only me.

I've written two. The first is a BtVS story that currently stands at 80 pages of actual story, 30 more of notes and dialog, and 5 of outline, plus 10 pages of deleted scenes. It assumes that canon remains the same up to "Once More with Feeling." (Please note that "Once More with Feeling" is the only episode of BtVS season six that I've seen - and I haven't seen any of five or four, either. No, wait - I think I've seen one episode in season four. My point is, the first clue I had to the ETMNBR status of this beast was that I was writing in canon I hadn't seen.) At that point, a single line changes, and this massively alters everything from then on. In terms of timeline, I've written up to where season nine would have been if there had been one, and I know how things will resolve in season ten.

There are only two people in the world who would be interested in this story; one is me, and the other is Best Beloved. We've both read it. I know it's an ETMNBR, so I'm not worried about finishing it. But I re-read it fairly regularly, and I still write on it from time to time, because it entertains me so damned much.

The other one is much more embarrassing because I didn't realize it was an ETMNBR until after I sent it to be beta-read. It's also rather long (and needs to be much, much longer), an AU that assumes canon up to a certain point and then sharply diverges, and entertaining only to me. (My poor, poor betas - some of them actually read the fucker, and provided really helpful, thoughtful, useful comments - in short, they helped me make a story that was interesting only to me even more interesting. To me. At the cost of a lot of their time and effort. I would send them flowers and chocolate except that I'm embarrassed to speak to them.)

Now for consensus. Feel free to judge harshly.

[Poll #851020]

Comments

[sanguinary.livejournal.com]

found my way here through a link on a friend-of-a-friends page and uh, wow, that first statement uncannily describes what I've been doing for the past five years. except, I actually ran (http://obliveeon.deadjournal.com/friends) with my imaginary fandom. Four other friends (and a few people who've left over time) and I have managed to create an entire canon universe to play in, plus alternate (http://www.greatestjournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=cville_pirates) universes (http://www.greatestjournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=yeoldcville) reachable by this universe, plus giant non-canon au's (http://www.greatestjournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=sanguinary&keyword=Drunken+Jellyfish+series&filter=all), plus vids (http://youtube.com/watch?v=aTO8XIP41Jk) and song-mixes (http://www.greatestjournal.com/community/obliveeon/88987.html).

We've basically taken our insanity to the next, inevitable level.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Okay, I just purely love this concept - fans building shared-universe fandoms. It's got this whole, "We can put on a show! We have everything we need right here!" atmosphere that fills me with unbridled glee.

(And, wow. You're not the only ones to have done this, but I don't think I've ever seen another fan-created shared-universe fandom with a vid. *marvels* *bookmarks to watch when other people aren't sleeping*)

We've basically taken our insanity to the next, inevitable level.

This is a most excellent thing. (And, huh. If you do yuletide, do you put down this fandom as one of your requests?)

[aderam.livejournal.com]

My ETMNBR exists but not in a concrete form. It's the kind of thing that I tell myself as I'm going to sleep at night or when I'm sitting around with nothing else to do. It's not written down mostly because I don't have time to do so, after all I mostly don't have time to write down things that should be read, let alone things that shouldn't be at all.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

*nods*

Do you do a lot of chopping and changing on it, swapping in characters (or fandoms) and changing around old plotlines and handwaving inconsistencies? Or is it more linear, like a written story would be?

(I'm finding, from the comments thus far, that this is what differentiates the two major categories of ETMNBX. And meta on this topic is being written as I'm answering these comments, so I'm curious. Well. I'd be curious anyway, but the meta is a good excuse for it.)

[mamadeb.livejournal.com]

It's not quite an epic that no one should read. People have read it. People read it while it was being written, because I wrote it in IRC to audiences. And I've been told it's good.

But. It's a The Sentinel novel. And I was in the middle of editing it when the the fandom kinda...folded. And then the computer died, and it was trapped on the harddrive there. We've gotten it out, but it's been four years since I've looked at it. And it still needs editing.

So it's going to sit on my hard drive.

And no one will see what happens if Jim Ellison is raped.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Ohhhhhh, you are a total fictease, because - not fair! The Sentinel is still a fandom! And, and, and...I want to read that.

*whines pathetically*

But we are totally not counting that as an ETMNBR. It should be read! Obviously!

*more whining*

[ellen-fremedon.livejournal.com]

I used to have ETMNBR, but these days, they're all Epics That Must Not Be Written-- I stopped actually writing them down when I started posting fanfic. But I still plan them out, and tell them to myself.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Interesting. So, for you, posting fan fiction switched the audience you write for from you to the fannish multitudes?

(Yeesh. That sentence was from hell. But I hope you can kind of see what I meant.)

[darkluna.livejournal.com]

I'm probably repeating a ton of everybody else's comments, but YES. I had a whole sitcom imagined out in my head once, including episodes, fan reaction, cameo appearances that made me (and would probably make only me) giggle... the works. And then there's the imaginary band that keeps trying to sneak in when I'm writing fiction I do intend to share someday.

I wrote an ETMNBR in junior high. This was before the intarwebz, thank goodness, but my co-author and I did share it with our classmates. Oh, the Sue-age. It was rampant. Now I don't write them down anymore. I let my Mary Sues and self-inserts run around in my head when I'm bored or winding down to go to sleep, as someone else mentioned, but I don't inflict them on anyone else.

Also, I hope you don't mind if I friend you. You seem like My Kind of People.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I'm probably repeating a ton of everybody else's comments, but YES. I had a whole sitcom imagined out in my head once, including episodes, fan reaction, cameo appearances that made me (and would probably make only me) giggle... the works. And then there's the imaginary band that keeps trying to sneak in when I'm writing fiction I do intend to share someday.

You are indeed repeating what other people have said, but this is a very good thing; after all, if I'm going to determine my sanity by consensus, I have to know what the consensus actually is. Every person who says, "Yes, I totally do that, and let me tell you how" is a vote for my sanity.

Plus, it's wonderful to hear what other people's imaginary fandoms are. I think you're the first person who has had a sitcom, which is just beyond cool.

I wrote an ETMNBR in junior high.

Oh. Oh, god. So did I, and I'm just grateful that it is safely lodged in a landfill somewhere, because - wow. It was, shall we say, very 12. (And I didn't write just one, either. I was a veritable fount of horrible fiction at that age. And then I turned into a teenager and starting writing poetry, which - well. I'm sure you can imagine. *shudders*)

Also, I hope you don't mind if I friend you. You seem like My Kind of People.

I'd be delighted! Friend at will. (And, see, this is why I adore fandom. Because only here could I find kindred spirits with this post. *cuddles fandom all night long*)

[kangeiko]

I sorta maybe have imaginary fandoms - in that I'll basically take one concept that I like, and then go and make a spin-off. So, much like Doctor Who has just been given Torchwood, and Babylon 5 had Crusade - and Buffy had Angel - I had - erm, well, I'm not telling. Because it's JUST THAT BAD.

Also, the big, big epics that you write in your head? Completely normal. Honest. Apparently, we all do it, even if we don't realise it. I have this one that's a riff on teenage horror movies and basically took a pick-axe to all of the Buffy characters, and no, I haven't written it, but the gory parts are imprinted on the inside of my eyelids FOREVER. It's not like it was a Mary Sue or anything - except that, yeah, it totally was - but, hey, at least she did something other than sexin' teh hawtties!

Also, everything happens in London. Everything. Every story. Except the ones that can happen in Edinburgh. The end.

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

Also, the big, big epics that you write in your head? Completely normal. Honest. Apparently, we all do it, even if we don't realise it.

Well...no, I can vouch that that isn't true. As is obvious from this post, quite a lot of people do, but that still doesn't mean everyone. Saying "I do this, too" is a great way to make TFV feel less crazy, but there's no need for sweeping generalisations.

[pocky_slash.livejournal.com]

(here via musesfool)

I wouldn't say that I have an "imaginary fandom" as much as I've sort of created a type of fannishness over the original universe that I write. I have the entire history of these characters written out and referred to in various stories, but (much the way I do with my actual fandoms) I really only write/work on the stories that appeal to my particular writing kinks. I know that back in the main timeline, in May 2006, the whole murder mystery aspect of the plot climaxes. But I'm not good at writing genre stories, I'm better at characters, so almost all of the stories written in that section of the timeline take place right AFTER the climax and focus on how the characters deal with the aftermath.

(I've also, embarrassingly enough, actually written AUs to this universe under the guise of my Creative Writing senior project.)

I think part of the slacking on the actual content of the story has to do with having no TIME to actually work on it (what with classes, internship, work, and editing the newspaper), so when I do have time to sit down and write, I want to write something that comes naturally and makes me happy. Thus, we get a story about buying new drapes or a story about the aftermath of a shitty day rather than substanative things.

But, regardless, I do actually indulge myself by imagining what sorts of ships and fic people would come up with if the work was published or wildly successful. Who would play what characters and which characters would be most popular and what kinds of crazy meta would be inspired by the end of section/book one. Which character people would blame for the ridiculous break up, and how that would effect people's perception of the characters getting back together, etc.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

(I've also, embarrassingly enough, actually written AUs to this universe under the guise of my Creative Writing senior project.

As far as I'm concerned, any time you're writing fan fiction - even if it's fan fiction of your own universe - and you're getting credit (or legitimate money) for it, you win. So, really, this is in no way embarrassing. It's a triumph of the human spirit!

*encourages you to make Paul Gross arms*

I want to write something that comes naturally and makes me happy.

*nods*

My thing is dialog. I love writing dialog and am really bad at, like, narrative and stuff, so almost all my scenes start out as dialog, and then I have to go back and add in the, you know, story bits. (It's really painful when I have to do parts that are entirely dialog-free. You know, like action and all the other things that make up that thing we like to call a plot.)

And I totally agree with the "indulge yourself" method of writing. Fun writing should be fun. (This is what I tell my stories when they start being difficult. They never listen.)

[dine.livejournal.com]

I am soooo in love with the concept, and really wish I could join the fandom for reals!

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Well, I'd say you're welcome to join the fandom, but sadly there's no there there. Except in my head. And me telling you, "And then they..." would really not be the same thing.

[chartophile.livejournal.com]

Also here linked from someone else. I read that last paragraph and couldn't stop laughing. I've done that too! I had a friend spend a month looking over this massive, horrible thing that was so entertaining I'm still pondering it. It had cross overs and these funny pop culture references nobody else would get... Anyway, yeah. Been there. Great post!

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

(Side note: I adore your icon. It is the prettiest in all the land.)

I've done that too! I had a friend spend a month looking over this massive, horrible thing that was so entertaining I'm still pondering it.

*weeps*

Oh, god, the shame. (And the really horrible part, the part so shameful I can't even begin to cope with it, is that these were all brilliant writers, people whose work I love. And...and...they read my ETMNBR. It's humiliating beyond all description.)

[snarkhunter.livejournal.com]

I don't have any ACTUAL ETMNBRs, in that I don't have any written. But there are several living in my head. Where they should probably stay.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Well, speaking from experience, the up side of writing them down is that you can re-read them and entertain yourself. And the down side is that you spend a long time writing something you can't show to anyone. (Or, worse, that you might succumb to madness or whatever and actually show to someone.)

On the whole, I think I'd let mine stay in my head, except that I never know they're ETMNBR until after I've written most of them.

[jmtorres.livejournal.com]

The question of imaginary fandoms is a little trickier when you're actually in the biz. I think of them as "future projects."

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I have named them, for the purposes of this poll (and the meta that will follow), fandoms in waiting. If you think you might someday write it down and try to sell it, it's not imaginary. (But you could have imaginary fandoms; it would just have to be something you never, ever planned to share, pitch, sell, or make.)

[rheanna27.livejournal.com]

Yes, I'm guilty of imaginary fandom syndrome too!

Mine was this SF TV show called Homer's Odyssey, which is about this guy called John Homer (OF COURSE!) who's from California but is in New York on a business trip when aliens, most inconveniently, invade. At the end of the pilot, Homer (stop picturing Homer Simpson, because I know you totally are) sets off on an Epic Journey across the continent to get back to his wife -- who's pregnant, naturally (note: nowhere am I claiming this is any good) -- accompanied by a bunch of other characters who all have their own reasons for wanting to go west. There's a female doctor and a cop and a teenage runaway and an alien who's a member of a slave race who are genetically engineered to serve the invading aliens (still with me?) and, oh, I have character arcs worked out and I know which 'ship is the big slash one and which is the het pairing of choice.

Also, I have a deep desire to do a Battlestar Galactica on Space 1999 and 'reimagine' a grittier version where the '1999' refers to 1999 survivors who are stuck on an international moonbase when nuclear war wipes out most of the rest of humanity. No, seriously.

[dzurlady.livejournal.com]

Also, I have a deep desire to do a Battlestar Galactica on Space 1999 and 'reimagine' a grittier version where the '1999' refers to 1999 survivors who are stuck on an international moonbase when nuclear war wipes out most of the rest of humanity. No, seriously
I have never seen Space 1999 but that sounds *really cool*.

[not-sally.livejournal.com]

I just had to tell you that weirdness aside, the concept of imaginary fandoms is... wow. Awesome.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

I feel much better about the whole fandom-in-my-head thing now that I know that a) other people do the same thing and b) some people actually don't hear about it and immediately say, "Wow. You are the most pathetic human being ever to walk the earth."

LJ polls heal. *nods firmly*

[carla-scribbles.livejournal.com]

Does it count if I'm pretty sure that at least one of my ETMNBRs is actually an Epic That Would Be So So Cool If I Could Just Figure Out How To Write It? (due South AU, Fraser ran off with Victoria at the end of Season 1, Kowalski and Vecchio are partners, and they're both really kind of fucked up and gay for each other, with Stella caught in the middle? Am I the only one who'd read that? And is it sad that that's the only possible scenario in which I could ever wholly buy Ray/Ray as a pairing?)

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I'm totally a Fraser/Kowalski girl, and I consider Ray/Ray a mutant fetish (so, you know, it's not like I won't read it, but I'm kind of wincing a little the whole time). But I'd sure as hell read that. So that is in no way, shape, or form an ETMNBR; it is, in fact, an Epic That Must Be Read, So You Really Need to Write It Already, Please Please Please. *nods firmly*

[erinptah]

Here from metafandom.

Come to think about it, I have played around in my head with kind of an imaginary Wizard of Oz fandom. (I say "imaginary" because, while there is Oz bookverse fandom, it's very old-fashioned: mostly mailing lists and zines and the like. I've toyed with the idea of what Oz fandom would look like if the books had been written ninety years later. Probably a lot like Harry Potter Fandom, is what I envision.)

Haven't gone into nearly as much detail as you have, but I've come up with things like fics that should be written. (And these can be fics that I wouldn't write myself, mind you - darkfic and smut, for instance.)

I also, come to think of it, have more than one Sailor Moon ETMNBR. I've been meaning for a long time to rewrite one of them into an interesting and readable epic, but it may never happen. Which is a shame, because I think it could be made interesting to other people.

...this is a very interesting poll, and has given me things to ponder. Thanks for laying your fannish psyche bare for us - it's intriguing!

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I say "imaginary" because, while there is Oz bookverse fandom, it's very old-fashioned: mostly mailing lists and zines and the like. I've toyed with the idea of what Oz fandom would look like if the books had been written ninety years later. Probably a lot like Harry Potter Fandom, is what I envision.

Ooo, cool! Have you seen liviapenn's and hradzka's posts on this? (On imagining what LJ fandoms for older books might look like, I mean.) If you're interested, you can find David's one on Holmes here (http://hradzka.livejournal.com/121802.html), and he links to Livia's post about the Wimsey series at the top of that one.

Have you ever written up your vision of Oz-written-today fandom? I find those posts fascinating. (Well. Obviously, since I have collection of them in my head.)

I also, come to think of it, have more than one Sailor Moon ETMNBR. I've been meaning for a long time to rewrite one of them into an interesting and readable epic, but it may never happen. Which is a shame, because I think it could be made interesting to other people.

Interesting. What do you think needs to be done to your epic to make it readable and interesting to others? (I'm, um, fishing for ideas, here - I mean, if there's a way to do that, I would seriously consider it, just because - well, I wrote these ETMNBR, and it'd be really nice to take the MNBR part of them.)

Thanks for laying your fannish psyche bare for us - it's intriguing!

It's what LJ is for! (You can lay your psyche bare in many places, but only in LJ do half the people who see it say, "Me, too!" and another 5% say, "Link?")

[ladyvyola.livejournal.com]

You mean there are people who don't do this?

Oh, yeah. We call those people "non-fans".

Heck, I know for a fact that my mother was telling ETMNBRs to herself while swinging in the backyard in Southern California in the 1940's. And she's talked my oldest nephew (age 3 yrs 8 mos) through telling himself stories as he goes to bed at night. Those stories feature dragons and hobbits and Spiderman and Robin and Han Solo and dinosaurs....

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Wow. Your family is breeding fans. That's incredibly admirable. A service to the future!

But, yeah, now I'm kind of wondering why I thought other fans wouldn't do this. It's like covers (only more so); I'm not surprised that so many fans love or collect cover versions of songs, because it makes sense and aligns perfectly with fannish interests. This does, too, but I was all caught up in this image of myself as weird and solitary and I totally forgot that I'm actually mostly not.

[monroe-nell.livejournal.com]

Ha, re: number 2, ALL in my head. If i wrote it down, it would be LONG. AS. FUCK.

Some how, Benton Fraser is related to Harry Potter (his mother and Lily's mother were cousins AND his paternal grandfather and James Paternal grandfather were identical twins) and fraser can do magick and it would have poltics and dumbledore attempting to ignor the will of james an dlily and put harry with the dursley's where he was abused until fraser found out james was dead...

And then he gets custody of Daniel Jackson and Blair Sandburg (who were half-brothers because Naomi was an American Spy - CIA - who had a nervous breakdown after her son Michael was kidnaped at 3 months (AND became Duo Maxwell - GW) and then Melbourne was killed because he was a british spy. Naomi and Claire jackson were cousins. *facepalm*

And then Fraser gets custody of lex luthor and rodney mckay. rodney isn't related to him, but he is lex's cousin. Lex is his godson and lillian sent him copies of abuse reports and blackmailed lionel for custody.

And somewhere in there, House and Fraser end up together and at some point elliot (from law and order: svu) turns out to be House's half-brother.

Sometimes I rewrite it so House has custody of daniel and blair, or elliot has custody of blair and house of daniel.

(The WHOLE basis for this? EYES - blue or green (I like to assume redheads have green eyes...)

Um. The other ETMNBW, Fraser = Heero Yuy. With minor crossover to rourni kenshin.

See, Fraser was kidnapped by Odin, who was actually Muldoon's less-crazy brother, after fraser was kidnapped by muldoon a couple of months after his mother was murdered. He ends up with j, runs away back to his grandparents, J shows up and tells him he either comes with him or he kills his grandparents and then he arranges almost!deadly "accidents".

Fraser goes back with J, allows his name to be changed, at 16 he joins the preventers special forces task unit, at 18 he is asked to go undercover as a mountie, so he goes, Okay - I'll take after my father, and the other pilots go "bzuh?"

So fraser goes undercover and works part time with the preventers. Fast-forward, and it turns out the reason fraser was going to run away with victoria is because that was his new assignment from the preventers, because she is involved with child explotation.

And fraser is part japanese because his mother is the japanese princess who is descended of a red-hair/purple eyed rourni whose daughter married the emperor's son. Er, and he's 1/4 british and 1/4 inuit and he is STILL related to Harry Potter.

And I have cracked!out fandoms for my fics. *wins*

I also plan to be a published writer some day, so I spend half the time i'm writing one of my novels - thinking who would slash which characters and general fandom-personality types and which character would be bashed by everyone, and whether the evil!character would end up with fanboys and girls. And what the ship_manifesto people would say for their pairings. Seriously, I have one sketched out.

And I would totally write in my novel's fandoms under an assumed name. Delibertly bad!fic, etc... I think it would be amusing.

[monroe-nell.livejournal.com]

I am an idiot. 2 pages to delete a comment and i still do it. *wins*

I feel as if I should expound on the first part (fraser and house with the horde of kids) after comments from bluebrocade here (http://monroe-nell.livejournal.com/211341.html)


BB: So...let me get this straight. House and Fraser are lovers and parents/guardians to Rodney McKay, Lex Luthor, Harry Potter, Daniel Jackson, *and* Blair Sandburg?!?! Where does RayK and Jack O'Neill fit into this?

Me: Last time I checked (in my head, ha - it becames a fact if it stays for more than 3 days of me thinking about it), jack had custody of his 3rd cousin, Jim Ellison. Cuz people thought he was being all mentally, emotionally and verbally abusive to his son - who was obviously have absent seizures and needed medical care.

but jack started noticing when jimmy had these seizures, so he took Jim to the best diagnostician around. And jimmy meets little blair (who is 5 years younger than daniel, so blair is 4. Harry is about 2 now, rodney is 12, Lex switches between 11 and 13). Jimmy is 11-ish.

Fraser is still working with vecchio (season 1/2, ha) and rayk is the cop who was selected to escort a case worker to talk to fraser and house. Allegations of abuse because Daniel was mute, and all the kids were home schooled (tutors, and fraser being sekritely hiding PH.D's in lingustics and medieval english lit. and masters in anthropology and pyschology). *g*

BB: I love that you have even their ages worked out. Do Blair and Jimmy becomes BFF after they meet?

Me: House decides that Jimmy isn't fucked up or epilitic. He makes up coping stratigies, etc... with Jack, and while those two work, Jimmy and Lex and Rodney play.

The play may involve mixing chemicals to make explosioins - which is another reason child protective services was called in.

And little blair wanders into the "lab" and Jimmy is the one who saves Blair from having his hair scorched all the way off, but the smell of the burning hair sends Jimmy into a zone. Rodney and Lex panick and get Fraser and Jack and House (cuz Jimmy was only going into the hospital for tests and observations, he wasn't generally kept for more than 24-48 hours - most stuff was done at House and Fraser's home) and they come back and little blair is petting Jimmy's hair like he's a kitty-cat and pulls Jimmy out of the zone.

And blair follows Jimmy around and calls him kitty and keeps trying to give him doggie treats and Jimmy is all, "Dude, Lex, your cousin/brother/whatever he is is WEIRD."

And the whole time, Daniel is hiding in his room, and he knows sign language and fraser is all "dude, how the hell do I get the kid to talk and he's not deaf so why does he think i'll think him turning his back means he's being rude."

And Harry likes to follow after blair, but he often gets really scared of loud noises, so even though he is fascinated by blair (and his HAIR) he is most often found with daniel. Daniel is teaching Harry how to read Egyptian hierglyphs because Harry used his magick to make a telepathic connection between the two.

[the-wanlorn.livejournal.com]

Back when I was in ickle 13-year-old, writing my ETMNBR and posting it online (which I still do), people would review to point out that it was a giant Mary Sue, and I would be so confused.

"Uh, yes, it is, thank you for pointing that out. Am I allowed to point out that that's kind of the entire point?"

Poor fandom! I'm sure it had had the likes of me released on it before, but I don't think it'd ever had the likes of me who knew I was the likes of me at the time, if that makes any sense!

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

*snickers*

You were unrepentantly Mary Sueing, and I think that's very wonderful. Go proto-you!

(Although - actually, I've never seen the point in reviewing to tell people their OCs are Mary Sues. I don't think it can accomplish much, except either confusing the author or getting her upset. We all go through the Mary Sue phase. Some people - including some rather successful original fiction writers - never outgrow it. But those of us who do - well, you have to figure out on your own why a flawed character is more interesting and more lovable than a perfect one. No one can tell you. Either you see it or you don't. So - yeah, I don't get it.)

[thepouncer.livejournal.com]

For as long as I can remember, I've created universes in my head, combinations of different fictional worlds - rarely truly original. There's a name for them: paracosms. I created characters and socio-political background and history and *floorplans* and rarely had an actual story to tell. Plot? I laugh at plot! Which leads into my answer for the second question: I rarely wrote any of these down, and it's the same with fanfiction epics. They are in my head, not my hard drive, and the ones that reach true epic status usually involve Mary Sue inserts into the midst of canon, where I can seduce my favored character and make him see that I'm perfect for him, really! Once or twice, I've told fannish friends the basics of these fantasies, and they usually sigh and admit they've got something similar on tap. Writing is too difficult for me to put words on paper when I'm not going to share the story. If it's one that I don't know how to tell, I keep it to myself, in surround sound and vision and scent and emotion, and enjoy it lots and lots.

[raucousraven.livejournal.com]

HUZZAH. I thought I was the only one who did the floorplans. Oh, and sometimes the winter clothes, too, right down to the symbologies.

[pollitt.livejournal.com]

Oh my god. God. Hell, *insert whatever Deity you want*. One of my ETMNBR was found (hand writing. Notes and all. We are talking over 100 pages.) the other day, which made me think of another one, which happens to be an imaginary fandom. This is almost eerie timing.

You are so not alone.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

OMG. I hope it was found by, um, someone relatively sympathetic; I mean, having the wrong people read your ETMNBR is traumatizing.

You are so not alone.

*bonds*

*seriously considers forming Imaginary Fandom and Epics That Must Not Be Read support groups*

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Ahaha, your poll just inspired me to actually *post* about my imaginary fandom. And then spend the evening discussing names and secondary characters and relationships. Awesome.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

I read that, and you are AWESOME.

That is all.

*admires your tasty, tasty brains*

[purna.livejournal.com]

(Here via metafandom, btw.)

*flails*

My reaction to the first question was "Wow, you, too?" Because I've been a big ole slasher since I was a kid, but at the start, it wasn't for a TV show. I had a warlock sex magic world, a vaguely Zane Grey-ish outlaw cowboy world, and an ephebe/mentor Greek warriors world (completely ripped off from Mary Renault, guilty, your honor), just off the top of my head. I'd be embarrassed, except that all the stories stayed in my head because I knew my mom would find and read anything I wrote down.

Glad to know I'm not the only one!

As for the second question I'm not sure. Um, I hope not? I try to keep my most self-indulgent, audience-of-one stories in my head, so I definitely recognize the impulse.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Because I've been a big ole slasher since I was a kid, but at the start, it wasn't for a TV show.

Oh, yes. I was responding to slashy vibes long before I was old enough to think in terms of romance and sex; I just knew I loved a certain kind of dynamic between two men, and would become obsessed with any book in which I found that dynamic. (These books tend to be my Yuletide requests now; I'm always hoping I'll find the one other person who found I, Robot slashy.)

And I also created my own universes with my own stories, and of course there were certain slashy vibes there, too. (Mostly femslash, though, come to think of it, until age 14 or so.)

I had a warlock sex magic world, a vaguely Zane Grey-ish outlaw cowboy world, and an ephebe/mentor Greek warriors world (completely ripped off from Mary Renault, guilty, your honor), just off the top of my head.

Warlock sex magic and outlaw cowboys make my heart sing with joy. And I, too, had a mentor/ephebe world. (This was before I discovered Renault, though; I was basing it off what I'd read about Greek society. But when I did find Renault, my immediate reaction was, "Oh my god, someone else does this! Someone else wrote my story!" It was a wonderful, wonderful moment.)

[http://users.livejournal.com/_tallian_/]

Linked here by musesfool.

This is *awesome*. While I've never done things like this myself, being rather on the fringes of fandom per se, I think the imaginary fandoms and ETMNBR (you realize I now want to read that BtVS epic) are fascinating. I like your brain. May I friend you?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Oh, yes - friend at will! I'm delighted to be friended.

(And, well, I have an agreement with a friend that I'll post at least the first chapter of my ETMNBR if she does a specific thing. I don't think she will, but if she does, do you want me to let you know? I think it's the kind of thing any sane person would avoid, but, hey, if it turns out to be something you actually do want to read, that's my audience doubled, right there.)

[furies.livejournal.com]

oh, oh. the ETMNBR. yes, do i have those. massive things that are impossible. because i'm such a canon freak, i have things that have started out as character sketched that are now over 10,000 words and will never see the light of day. i have two TWW epics, that will never be finished (one, because i mary-sue up the ying-yang), and an SVU epic case-file that is actually completely plotted out, has an outline, has how the reveals will happen and where the clues will be - but the characterizations are TERRIBLE and since i know what happens, i really have no interest in putting the whole thing together. (this is why i so resist outlining things. i bore myself.)

sigh. stupid fanfic. stupid me for falling in love with epics at first sight and desperately wanting to write one, though i will never have an attention span that lasts that long.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

(this is why i so resist outlining things. i bore myself.)

Someone - I think maybe musesfool? - did a really fascinating poll on this, on whether or not people outline or plot where the story is going or whatever, and why they did or didn't. A lot of people in that poll said they avoid outlining because then they don't bother finishing the story, so, hey - you're not alone.

I tend to outline stories I have to write (challenge stories; basically, Yuletide) so that I have a map in case the going gets rough, but otherwise, I don't, because, yeah - once I've sketched out the story, it's not easy to motivate myself to fill in the lines.

(I do take lots of notes, though. For some reason, notes are not the same as outlining; they don't kill my urge to write the actual story.)

stupid me for falling in love with epics at first sight and desperately wanting to write one, though i will never have an attention span that lasts that long.

In my experience, this is one of those things where practice helps. (I can't say it makes you perfect, or even good, at writing epics, because I still suck at it. Well, obviously, given my ETMNBR issue. But I've gotten faster at it and can stay the course for longer, which is progress. Um. Of a kind.)

[avenginglyyours.livejournal.com]

I... hum, have an imaginary fandom. Well, tw- thre- four, actually. But I like to think that, as a wannabe comic books writer/artist who will probably end up not even drawing a webcomic, it's normal for me to have those strange plot bunnies that develop into incredibly long and complicated stories. Because they might one day become a real plot that will interest other people ! (shh, it's rude to yell "delusional" at people) And I understand what you mean when you say imaginary fandoms are embarrassing, since one of mine has a class society that has had the same cloned king as its leader for a few thousand years (and you probably understand when I say it's complicated).

Concerning Epics That Must not be Named... the only reason there isn't any on my computer is that they could be used against me that I just imagine them. In my head. It is my opinion that I am a very sucky writer and therefore should not inflict the AUs that crowd my brain on the english language - every now and then, I'll just think "so, where was I with that story ?" and get lost in thought for a while and emerge incredibly satisfied with my new plot development. Most of the times, I end up forgetting half the story and have fun creating a new beginning that could have lead to the ending I remember. Am I pathetic yet ?
To be honest, though, I did want to make a comic out of one of those AUs. I had thirty pages entirely planned (dialogues, panels, colors and all) and an incredible number of scenes that I could describe in details. But I stopped drawing after page 7 because my holidays were ending.

/end of the novel

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Because they might one day become a real plot that will interest other people !

I totally agree with this. If you have plans to do original creative work, then they aren't imaginary fandoms; they're fandoms in waiting. Which, hey, doesn't that sound better?

Am I pathetic yet ?

Not even remotely. As it turns out, this is normal fangirl behavior - I do this, definitely, but the great part is that other people do, too. This is a massively exciting discovery for me, that I'm not crazy, just fannish.

Hmmm. Perhaps I will make that my new motto. "Not crazy, just fannish" sums me up rather well, I think.

I did want to make a comic out of one of those AUs.

Oh, cool! You totally should. The fan fiction in graphic novel/comics form that I've seen - especially the ones for TV or book fandoms - are so amazingly wonderful; I love them and think there should be many many more of them. (Although I tend to stare at them with sick envy, because their creators are talented at writing and drawing, and that's just - wow.)